Major Doyle faid, that as he was the first person in that houfe who declared his determination to give entire and total emancipation to the Roman catholics of Ireland, he felt himfelf called upon to fay a very few words in anfwer to fome arguments which had been urged against the measure.

He difclaimed its belonging to party; it was of too great magnitude, and he should hold that man the most infamous in fociety, who could fport with the feeling of three millions for fo unworthy a purpofe.

He denied it could affect the interest of the proteftant religion, which he refpected. But he thought the idea of afcendancy, as applicable to religion, not only weak, but nearly impious. What had religion to do with it?

The Holy Author of our religion preached against afcendancy; he preached humility, and you do not find in the bible, from Genefis to Revelations, one word of commiffioners of the revenue or excise, or tafters of wines, &c.

It is a question of power, not between the king and his people, for their intereft is, and I hope always will be the fame; but between four-fifths of the people of Ireland on the one part, and a few interefted individuals on the other, who, like all monopolifts, wifh to exclude others from a fhare.

It is fo with the monopolifts of the India trade in England; it is fo with those of the African trade in England; and it is fo with the monopolies of the Irish flave trade.

I fhall pass over the fpeech of the learned member (Doctor Duignan), as it applied to every thing but the petition which had been actually before the houfe. The only affertion relative to it feemed to be, that fuch laws as

the

ple, haters of civil government.-But you can do nothing without the aid of your catholic brethren.

Colonel Cunningham next obferved, that gentlemen formed their opinions from this town and its neighbourhood.

That no wonder the fupplications of 3,000,000 of people had no effect on certain gentlemen of crooked policy, who fit in this houfe only to withdraw all connexion between this country and England.

That he thought however the Roman catholics were daily increafing in their demands-Their claims in the course of last year extended no farther than the elective franchise and trial by jury.

Mr. Chamberlaine objected to the granting any fhare in the legislature to any but under due qualifications. The law had wifely provided a qualification, to which he faw nothing in the catholic religion that could be a prohibition.

The teft inftituted at the Revolution was a political teft: but that of Ireland in particular was a religious one, fince an Irish catholic may hold all the articles of the church of Rome, and yet abjure all the articles of the Revolution.

The religion of the catholic attaches him to the monarchical part of the conftitution; and in that fense is in itself a parliamentary reform.

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He confidered the elective franchife the restoration of a right; he would therefore infift upon itbut would at the fame time infift, that the parti cipation ought to be gradual, not a full one altogether.

Major

they complained of might be on the books, but were not put in force. Sir, faid Major Doyle, if they are too bad to be enforced, they are too bad to be there, and I never will confent to entrust the liberty of my fellow-fubjects to the caprice, or even the good-nature of the magiftrate. Away with the difmal code! compared with it, the Draconian code was mercy. The fword of Damocles, hung with a fingle hair over my head, is a greater punishment than though it fell and crufhed me.

It is faid, if catholics get the franchise, they will speedily acquire landed property. Why, fir, they muft firft obtain freeholds, for the bill only gives them eligibility; then they will vote for their landlord, if he be a good one, as the diffenters do indifcriminately, without regard to religion.

But how are the catholics to get the landed property? it is one hundred to one against them in landed property---and will both parties magically change their qualities on the paffing of the bill? The proteftant to become idle and diffipated, and the catholic industrious and frugal, fo as by induftry, to purchase all the landed property.---Why, fir, if they should ever be superior in numbers and also in landed property, you could not, nor ought not prevent their having a pre-eminence in the ftate. Look fir, faid he, to Canada---fee there a conftitution framed by his prefent majefty, afferted by his present minifter. Their houfe of affembly, (is anfwerable to our house of commons,) confifts of 50 members, of which 35 are catholics and 15 protestants. The bufinefs of government and the country goes on well. The 35 are there, not in confequence of their catholicity, but because they have the landed property, which must and ought always to prevail.---I mention this to fhew that when power is out of the question, religion will be very quiet.

To this may be objected the capitulation of Montreal, to which I oppose the capitulation of Lime

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rick. Let the one answer the other; but I care not for capitulations---their claim for freedom refts on better bafis--they derive it from God and from Nature.

It is faid, they will obtain the high offices of the ftate---but gentlemen forget it is the king who gives them away, and of courfe will not chufe the feditious.

It is faid the poorer fort don't wish the franchise; I know not how people can learn their opinion. They probably. are ignorant of the meaning of the term, but if they knew, that by having it, they will be protected from being turned out of their farms, to make room for freeholders, they will then thank you for the franchise. But it is faid that this feldom happens---Sir, we have all often feen advertisements for lands to be let," and none but a proteftant need "apply." I have one in my hand, faid he, within the laft fortnight to the fame effect. It is afked will the catholic be fatisfied with this bill? Sir, it would be prefumption to answer for any body of men. But, I have no doubt they will be grateful to their fovereign and the legislature, for what they do get---of course they would be ftill better pleafed to get more. But, if they were loyal before with their former oppreffion, furely they will not be lefs fo when they are materially relieved. It would be abfurd to fuppofe they would never look further. "The higher 66 you afced to the hill, the more extended will be "the view." Let us give then fpeedily "qui dat cile "dat bis." Away with the left handed wisdom of governing by divifions! Govern a whole people !--Let us give generously, and have no craving void left aching in the breaft."

Mr. Graydon spoke but few words intended as a caution to guard against the danger of extending. privileges of any body of men without the greatest

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Mr. Grattan, I could wish the bill under your confideration had gone farther. I could wish that it had given the roman catholics the privileges of other diffenters. I am fure that is the only found policy. I think, however, the bill deserves thanks, because it contains much, and also be cause it leads to much more-but I muft fay the mover had discovered more fenfe if he had given to the catholics the whole now, and had fettled with them for ever.

The fituation of the roman catholics is reducible to four propofitions; they are three-fourths of your people paying their proportion of near 2,000,000l. of taxes, without any fhare in the representation or expenditure; they pay your church eftablishments, without any retributions; they discharge the active and laborious offices of life, manufacture, hufbandry and commerce, without those franchifes which are annexed to the fruits of industry, and they replenish your armies and navies, without commiffion, rank, or reward; under these circumftances, and under the further recommendation of total and entire political feparation from any foreign prince or pretender, they defire to be admitted to the franchife of the conftitution: I have liftened to your objections with great refpect--give me leave to answer them.

The firft objection I heard, is the petition of the catholics to his majefty; but, who is there that does not see the queftion to be, whether the catholics are aggrieved, and not how thofe grievances have been stated by their committee. But even, on the ground of the petition, if as in a case of bill and answer, you choose, to wrangle, you will find their petition is fubftantially true-it complains that the catholic, by law, cannot carry arms the law is fo-it complains that the catho

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lics,